Paradise Cafe Discussions - A Place For Bible Research And Christian Encouragement

I think the 'no comment' reply gives a clue to your mindset. You haven't read/considered my thoughts given on this thread so far.....thanks for being honest.

Hi Linda

Sorry. I should have been more clear. I did not intend for you to understand my comment to mean I have not read your posts. I have.
(It is just that I felt your comment was inappropriate and did not want to say so.)

Regarding the teaching that the resurrection has already taken place, I have just reflected on 2 Timothy 2:11 - 20. It is my current understanding that this scripture is relevant to our day. I feel it is possible to subvert the faith of some by promoting such things as mentioned in the scripture (..., saying that the resurrection has already occurred..).

I feel I understand you view on this (resurrection typs...physical/spiritual etc.), Linda...yet do not agree with your view.

Take care.

Christian love,

gogh

O.K...What does all this have to do with the topic....does anyone go to heaven? Do you believe anyone does (irregardless of whether its future or is occuring)?

Thank you for the question, Lind.

Re: "...does anyone go to heaven?"

My understanding is not all followers of Jesus Christ have been/are/will be "ambassadors substituting for Christ".

I understand our resurrected Master has become immortal and will have (from among his followers) ones that will be with him and be immortal as well. I do not think of heaven as a 'location'...because the spirit realm cannot be defined/described/understood, by mortals (human),imo.

2 Corinthians 5:20...

"We are therefore ambassadors substituting for Christ, as though God were making entreaty through us. As substitutes for Christ we beg: “Become reconciled to God.” The one who did not know sin he made to be sin for us, that we might become God’s righteousness by means of him."

Take care, Linda

Christian love,

gogh

edited to add (human)...and this note (not all spirits are immortal,imo)

Hmm. The resurrection has to happen sometime. So 2 Tim 2:11-20 cannot possibly be applicable in every time period, can it?

The question is: Who is "we"? Well, that's easy. Look at the beginning of the letter: "Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus through God’s will, and Timothy our brother to the congregation of God that is in Corinth, together with all the holy ones who are in all of A·cha´ia"

In other words, this applied to all of the Christians in the region, and no doubt all of the Christians worldwide. Why wouldn't that still be the case?

Hi Donbodo

Re: "...cannot possibly be applicable in every time period, can it?"

It seems a first resurrection will be more of an event...

1 Thessalonians 4:17..."...and those who are dead in union with Christ will rise first. Afterward we the living who are surviving will, together with them, be caught away in clouds to meet the Lord in the air; and thus we shall always be with [the] Lord."

Another resurrection of righteous and unrighteous seems to occur over a long (thousands years?) period of time (last day).

Was this not alluded to by Martha?

John 11:23...

"Jesus said to her: “Your brother will rise.” Martha said to him: “I know he will rise in the resurrection on the last day.”


Re: "Why wouldn't that still be the case?"

If I understand you correctly.....Ya, why wouldn't that still be the case?

Christian love

gogh

So...is an unimmortal just a mortal?

gus

touché

Haha. I think it's just the opposite. The resurrection in 1 Thess 4:17 is, in my mind, the second resurrection, and the one alluded to by Martha (and the one in 1 Thess 4:16) is the first.

Linda thank you,

For your reply.

Don't worry about steppin' on toes...you've given my brain a work out instead. :D Maybe a reconstruction.


Love,
Tessa

Dear Gogh,

No, no I was not trying to single you out please remember the last thing I said.

"I'm not saying anyone here thinks highly of themselves it's the teaching that's been handed down to us that lacks humility."

Digging

I wish to share one more fresh reason to see the earth and human life as our permanent blessed gift.

We learn that the hope and blessing that we have as Christians is linked directly to Abraham.

The bible is very clear as to what God promised him. Act 7:4,5 Williams

"...Then after the death of his father, God had him move to this country in which you now live. He gave hime no property in it, not even a foot of land, and yet He promised to give it to him and his descendants after him, as a permanent possession,..."

So when is Abraham going to receive what God promised him?? Through the resurrection to life on earth.
We are to be blessed together will faithful Abraham. Ga 3:8

Digging

Greetings friends,

I found another scripture that I had forgotten all about, but I feel it is very related to this subject!

Eze37:9Then He said to me, "Prophesy to the breath, prophesy, son of man, and say to the breath, 'Thus says the Lord GOD, "Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe on these slain, that they come to life.'""
Eze 37:10 So I prophesied as He commanded me, and the breath came into them, and they came to life and stood on their feet, an exceedingly great army.
Eze 37:11 Then He said to me, "Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel; behold, they say, 'Our bones are dried up and our hope has perished. We are completely cut off.'
Eze 37:12 "Therefore prophesy and say to them, 'Thus says the Lord GOD, "Behold, I will open your graves and cause you to come up out of your graves, My people; and I will bring you into the land of Israel.
Eze 37:13 "Then you will know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves and caused you to come up out of your graves, My people.
Eze 37:14 "I will put My Spirit within you and you will come to life, and I will place you on your own land. Then you will know that I, the LORD, have spoken and done it," declares the LORD.' "

The hope of a resurrection back to life on earth was the hope for 1000's of years.

Digging

Hello there Jackie .. Digging :giverose:

What you quoted could also apply to those coming out of false religion ( scriptures show that these establishments are pits of darkness were death is it's master )... and those being raised to new life could mean they are brought up from their debased condition  in these houses ( graves ) ...... it all depends on how one understands these scriptures.

I would like to ask tho what most think this everlasting life is referring to .. I personally think that it has nothing to do with a physical body living forever but relates to something completely different.

Maybe I should take this to the new forum area since it might be upsetting to some ... but here are some definitions concerning everlasting :

Take a good look at the following and see if something other than the physical life that lives forever comes to mind ...

Everlasting ...
1 : lasting or enduring through all time : ie. ETERNAL (1) : continuing for a long time or indefinitely

Eternal ....
1 a : having infinite duration : EVERLASTING  b : of or relating to eternity
2 a : continued without intermission : PERPETUAL  b : seemingly endless
4 : valid or existing at all times : TIMELESS

Forever ...
1 : for a limitless time <wants to live forever>
2 : at all times : CONTINUALLY

Continual ...
1 : continuing indefinitely in time without interruption
2 : recurring in steady usually rapid succession <a history of continual invasions>
synonyms CONTINUAL, CONTINUOUS, CONSTANT, INCESSANT, PERPETUAL, PERENNIAL mean characterized by continued occurrence or recurrence.

CONTINUAL often implies a close prolonged succession or recurrence .
CONTINUOUS usually implies an uninterrupted flow or spatial extension .
CONSTANT implies uniform or persistent occurrence or recurrence .
INCESSANT implies ceaseless or uninterrupted activity .
PERPETUAL suggests unfailing repetition or lasting duration .
PERENNIAL implies enduring existence often through constant renewal <a perennial source of controversy>.

Timeless ....
2 a : having no beginning or end :
ETERNAL b : not restricted to a particular time or date
3 : not affected by time : AGELESS

I'm sure that these previous words brought out something relating more to what GOD was offering Adam and what Christ has received that doesn't relate to the physical body ;)

Love always, LC :heartbeat:

Dear Friend,

Yes I aways can see a illustrations within real true stories. However regarding the point you made of the religions being pits of darkness where death is the master. I ask why is death thier master? Most I find have not yet have come alive spiritually,do we view the unborn as dead? But these ones are alive phyically, so could it be that if they continue in their path it will lead them to death??

I would love it if you started a new topic in the new section and bring out the thoughts you've been having!

Digging