Paradise Cafe Discussions - A Place For Bible Research And Christian Encouragement

Greetings all my dear friends.....I hope that all are well:hibye:

2 Corinthians 5:1-10

For we know that if the earthly house of our tabernacle be dissolved, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal, in the heavans. 2.For verily in this we groan, longing to be clothed upon with our habitation which is from heaven: 3. if so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked. 4. For indeed we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened; not for that we would be unclothed , but that we would be clothed upon, that what is mortal may be swallowed up of life. 5. Now he that wrought us for this very thing is God, who gave unto us the earnest of the Spirit. 6. Being therefore always of good courage, and knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord 7. (for we walk by faith, not by sight): 8. we are of good courage, I say, and are willing rather to be absent, and to be at home with the Lord. 9. Wherefore also we make it our aim, whether at home or absent, to be well pleasing unto him 10. FOR WE MUST ALL BE MADE MANIFEST BEFORE THE JUDGMENT-SEAT OF CHRIST;THAT EACH ONE MAY RECEIVE THE THINGS DONE IN THE BODY, ACCORDING TO WHAT HE HATH DONE,WHETHER IT BE GOOD OR BAD.

The WTS taught that this was only for the heavanly class...but notice the verse 10 which says ALL must be made manifest before the Judgment seat of Christ.....and it makes a distinction of the things....done in the body.....

How do you understand these scriptures now?

Have a Spirit filled day , and Please pray to endure in love

your friend/sister in Christ

Sandi

I never felt I understood this scripture.  Then when I came to understand I am part of the Body of Christ, it speaks so much in how I feel.

Longing to be with the Christ,

As long I have to exist in this shell, my mortal body, my earnest spirit that was given me by the Christ, longs...very strongly for complete onesness with the Christ.  Yet if we continue on with the scripture:

"we are of good courage, I say, and are willing rather to be absent, and to be at home with the Lord. 9. Wherefore also we make it our aim, whether at home or absent, to be well pleasing unto him 10. FOR WE MUST ALL BE MADE MANIFEST BEFORE THE JUDGMENT-SEAT OF CHRIST;THAT EACH ONE MAY RECEIVE THE THINGS DONE IN THE BODY, ACCORDING TO WHAT HE HATH DONE,WHETHER IT BE GOOD OR BAD"

We can see what Christ expects of us.  We long so strongly for oneness, with the Christ, the head, and the Body of Christ.  Yet we see that our aim, or goal, is that while still in the flesh that we be pleasing to him.  For we ALL.. are to be judged by what we have done, while in the flesh.  Just like Jesus gave talents to each one of us.  Have we used them?  Are we trying to use our gift to build the body, nourish it, and to bring others to the understanding of the Christ?  So when we finally are able to shed the last of the flesh, and be with our Lord, he can sit on his Judgement seat and be pleased with the results of the Talents he gave us.. To use while in the body.

Love Lynn:heartbeat:

Hi Lynn....so good to see your post:hibye:

dear friend....we are seeing eye to eye....yes.....notice too its says....our EARTHLY house ....in contrast with what...it can only be our heavanly body......

I meditated in the Holy Spirit which let me see with eyes of understanding....and see things the same way you do....as Christs disciples we are to be showing love for all while we are slaves trapped in this fallen flesh...helping others who are held captives in this fallen flesh we all need it....as we are growing old an dying...sick...in need of help from another...and this is our obligation in showing love.....

I've used many words to get a single thought Lynn...but I hope you can see what I'm saying:ok:

your friend/sister in Christ

PS......I tried for so long to tell my mom and others how I longed to  be with Christ...but I felt (and I could be wrong) as though no one took me serious and the elders just more or less scoffed.

but I see your feeling the same way....its like Jesus is the magnet and we are the steel ...irresistably drawn to Him:heartbeat:

Amen FC,

I am so very happy for you, now is the time to continue with endurance and patience.

"Christs disciples we are to be showing love for all while we are slaves trapped in this fallen flesh..." to me this is hell
As paul said that which he desired he did not do but that which he did not desire is what he practiced. or someting like that. our very own personal torment is how I take it.. till we have aparting of the ways with the flesh.. and we are with the christ. to me this is two fold.

Peace Flower

Hi TD....how have you been...:hibye:

the scripture you quoted...can get you tripped up on the things you don't do , from the things you do:)...like lets see did I say that right:thinking:

Yes....we as JW and I speak for myself....as I can only speak from my own experiences...but I do know that when I was a JW.....I had knowledge of Christ...but it stopped there.....now I know Jesus...and when you speak to a JW about Jesus in this way...they are having no part of the conversation....the WTS has been very successful in keeping its members from Christ:(

Take Care of yourself

your friend/sister in Christ

Sandi

PS....in fact I'll go one step further and say I was puffed up with knowledge minus Jesus.....just makes me so sad to think about....because they are so well meaning and sincere.....

I think it is rather clear that the "we" in the scripture is separate from the "earthly tent".

The scripture is clearly saying there is an "us" that is able to be absent from the body and present with the Lord.

Funny how when you you just read the bible you come up with the same things the Christian church, aka "Christendom", has taught from the begining.

Grace and peace to you Flowerchild, in Him,
iknowhim

Goodmorning iknowhim.....how have you been

its good to see your post this morning....it's becoming clear so many things....once I let the Holy Spirit lead me instead of GB/WTS.....

And they tell us and continue to say ...if you don't listen to them/WTS , you will go into darkness and become just like all the rest..the WTS really is evil and controlling...and kept us from really seeing the truth.....and from Christ.....well I don't want to start ranting this early...but I pray that JW membes eyes are open to what they are serving....they are serving the GB....not Jesus nor Jehovah.

Its a shame for them...that they are so blinded.

Take Care

When we meet the Risen One..........scales fall off our eyes and we "see"!

Acts 9:18
18 And immediately there fell from his eyes something like scales, and he regained his sight, and he got up and was baptized;
(NAU)

Hi TD!

It reminds me of and when a friend of mine use to say: "If this is the life I don't fear the hell!!

Take care and with love.

Talkactive.

Ecclesiastes 1:18!
For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow.
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People can’t hear and carry the truth, because the lies are tickling their ears!

Jeremiah 8:8!
How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain.

Dear Flowerchild!

Have you ever thought of that those responsible for that other persons has been killed or die often are those who sentence all others to the death! How does it come that I can say so?

Let's take Moses he killed an Egyptian and sentenced a man to the death, who worked at the Sabbath, even that the law didn't describe it that way.

Let's take David, he was responsible for that Uriahs was killed in a mostly spekulative and evil manner. When he was confronted with his crime, he sentenced the one who had taked another mans only sheep to the death, without any discussion or mercy!

When it comes to Saulus from Tarsus, he accepted Stephens death and sent thousands of Christians into a premature death and when he becomes Paul what happend then......!

It seeems to be the like with the men behind the Watchtower Society they have sent thousands and other thousands of Brothers, Sisters and their Children into a premature death and still do, based at threats and sanctions, that is maybe why they are so kean to condemned all others, those who didn't like to follow their man made doctrines and organisation.

David he repent, but the men behind the Watchtower Society havn't show that they even were sorry for what they have been responsible for and afforded, with their ban on vaccinations as the act of Satan, organ transplant as cannibalism, medical treatment with blood and derivates, even that they are responsible for more death casualties than Jim Jones was and not to forget, they are still doing it in the name of Jehovah, putting bloodguilt and dirt at His name!

Christian love to all of you.

Talkactive.

Ps. The Watchtowers hypocrisy in the blood question can be seen and are documented at http://www.ajwrb.org

Ecclesiastes 1:18!
For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
People can’t hear and carry the truth, because the lies are tickling their ears!

Jeremiah 8:8!
How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain.

NB. It has to be mentioned that blood as medicine or any other medicine isn't good medicine, since there will always be side effects, opposite the healing Jesus and his disciples afforded, showing what to come, but in the meantime we have to deal with the life itself as sacred and be able to make personal decisions, to sustain the most important for Jehovah and each individual, the life itself in accordance to Galatians 6:5 and not being forced by threats and sanctions into a premature death, by man made doctrines, in opposition to what comes forth in 2 Corinthians 1:24 and 1 Peter 5:3! Like Tully and thousands of others haven’t been able to do:

http://www.energeticsolutions.com.au/tully_story.pdf

Among other places documented in Awake from May 22, 1994! Thousands have died......

Talkactive wrote:

Could you provide that quote?

Goodmorning Talkactive.....good to hear from you.....absolutely the WTS are guilty of so many premature deaths from their control and false teachings....also consider the Spiritual death of many too....when they DF and stumble so many because of disagreeing with them/WTS/GB.....

When I tried to go back this last time.....and my final time....I felt as though I had to give up my love and adoration of Christ Jesus...for the WTS/GB....this will not ever happen....I won't listen to their lies anymore about Jesus.....how evil of them to accuse ones who have Jesus as being blinded and under the influence of the demons....which is what they do when they say the other religions are false and they are the only ones....I'm over the WTS finally....and see them for what they really are.....a cult....as you said they will never ever say they are sorry for all the lives they have ruined and torn apart and murdered from all their false teachings.

Hello Sandra!

Yes, my friend, I believe we are reading on the same page!  Now when it comes to taking this scripture and saying that this means all will attain a heavenly calling.. I am warry.  For me, it had very little to do with destination.  Much more to do with condition.  Our promise from Jehovah and Jesus is life and reconcilliation.  Not a place.  Will it be possible for us to be at one with Christ while in "this Flesh"?  The spirit he gave us makes us part of him, but it also longs to be with the Christ.  Our hearts long for that reconcilliation, in whatever manner it may happen.

It is clear from Revelation, that some of those who recieve their promise, do so by means of a heavenly body.  But what I find interesting is that "new Jerusalem" comes down out of heaven and becomes a connection between "God, Christ, and Man".  So can we really say with confidence, that our reward or gift, is of the permanet heavenly type, or can we simplify it to say, "we will be reconcilled to our Lord" and to the Father".  The "flesh" we have now, is not capable of that complete reconcilliation.

Now, saying all this, does not mean I disagree with your interpreation, for I feel we are very close in how we see it.  I just tend to focus of the reward, instead of the means.  :)

My Love to you,
My sister in Christ
Lynn

Goodmorning Lynn.:hibye:....I too don't understand all things....who does....and I won't claim to understand it all.....I don't know where I'll be...or what kind of body....there is a scripture which says....we don't know now what we shall be like...but when we see Jesus then we shall know....There is also a scripture which says....eye has not seen , and ear has not heard of the things instore us....

This I believe....we don't at present know all things....but how we long to....and how I long to be with Jesus....to see him face to face.

And I tell you Lynn....I had too much coffee...and this I know....I feel like jumping out of this fallen flesh skin:D:cheer: this I do know.

Take Care of yourself Lynn

your friend/sister in Christ

SAndi

Me too!  lets GO!

Coffee is a gift from above! hehe... I am on cup three!  Too much for me too.

I wish we could understand all things now, I long to know more about our Father's promises.  I guess I'll just have to be content with the glimpses he had given us.  It will be so wonderful that even our little human minds cannot imagine!

Until that day, may we all continue to circulate the love that was graced upon us.

Love
Lynn