Paradise Cafe Discussions - A Place For Bible Research And Christian Encouragement

And this good news of the kingdom will be preached throughout the whole inhabited earth as a testimony to all the nations, and then the end will come. - Matthew 24:14

I keep running into the thought expressed by some that the preaching work that Jesus speaks about at Matthew 24:14 is some sort of future preaching work.   I would be interested to know the basis for that idea.

Here are my thoughts:

At Matthew 28:19,20 Jesus gives the grand commission - "Go there and make disciples of all nations ... teaching them to obey everything that I have commanded you."   So there is a preaching work that begins just after Jesus' ascension.

Does this preaching work differ from the preaching work spoken about at Matthew 24:14?  

I don't think so because the message is the same.   It is the message of "the Kingdom" and it is for all nations.  During his own ministry Jesus was preparing his twelve apostles (sent ones, missionaries) in order to preach this message.   When Jesus sent them out he gave them the "good news" message which was, "The kingdom of heaven has come near" (Matthew 10:7)  This message than was the "good news of the kingdom".  Later Jesus would select 70 other disciples and send them out with the same message; "The kingdom of God has come near you" (Luke 10:9) Now what about the message of that Jesus commissions just before his ascending to Heaven?  It too is a message regarding the Kingdom; specifically, Jesus' enthronement as King. Before they had gone out with the message that the Kingdom has drawn near and now the thrilling news is the Kingdom has become a reality. Jesus says, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been give to me" (Matthew 28:18)  

So to review:

1. Jesus sends the twelve apostles preaching the "good news of the Kingdom" to Israel.
2. Jesus sends the 70 out preaching the good news of the Kingdom to Israel.
3. Jesus commissions his apostles and disciples to preach the good news of the kingdom to the nations.
   

With this in mind Matthew 24:14 seems to be the fulfillment of what Jesus has been preparing his disciples to do - that is to preach the kingdom message to Israel and all nations.   Jesus is here prophesying that they would successfully fulfill his commission to take the "good news of the Kingdom to all the nations" before the end would come.   Matthew 24:14 seems more like the culmination of the work that had started when Jesus was on earth and then got kicked off in a big way with the Christian congregation.

After Jesus ascension to Heaven the Good News of Jesus' kingship was preached to Judea and Galilee, then to Samaria and the Jewish Diaspora. The good news was carried by Paul to many parts of the Gentile world.  As we approach the time of the end of the Jewish system (70AD) the good news was preached to all parts of the Roman empire, possibly even coming so far as Britannia. There is evidence also that the message was taken even beyond to places like India and China.   Now in our day the good news has gone out to all parts of the Globe.

Are we today having a share in the disciple making work and promoting the "good news of the Kingdom" and of its risen King, Christ Jesus?   It would be a shame if we missed out on Jesus' commission while awaiting some sort of future preaching work.  

"How are they to call on one they have not believed in? And how are they to believe in one they have not heard of? And how are they to hear without someone preaching to them?  And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, “How timely is the arrival of those who proclaim the good news.” - Romans 10:14,15

Hi Anthony,

I think though Mathew 28:19, 20 and Mathew 24:14 closely connected both has different applications.

Mathew 28:19, 20 commands to make disciples is more a general one and Mathew 24:14 is specific one.

Revelation 11:3, 7
And I will give unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
And when they shall have finished their testimony , the beast that cometh up out of the abyss shall make war with them, and overcome them, and kill them.
Revelation 14:6
And I saw another angel flying in mid heaven, having eternal good tidings to proclaim unto them that dwell on the earth, and unto every nation and tribe and tongue and people; and he saith with a great voice, Fear God, and give him glory; [u]for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made the heaven and the earth and sea and fountains of waters.

So it seems to me that there will be a final face of witnessing after Jehovah cleanses his organization. As revelation pictured it as two witnesses preaching and getting killed by the beast and then revived.

How can one preach in 1914 that the hour of the judgement by God has come?
After 97 years still the hour hasn’t come.

So I think Mathew 24:14, Revelation 14:6 and Revelation 11:3, 7 will be fulfilled after God purifies his organization. (1 peter 4:17)

Hi Anthony

Yes, I agree that Mathew 24:14 does not have a narrow fulfillment at the "end", but has been fulfilled over the past 2,000 years with the spread of the "good news" first to the Roman empire, then to the entire globe.

Personally, I'm not sure the "end" being referred to by Jesus is the end of the Jewish age, since the Roman empire did not constitute "all nations". Plus, if the "end" was the destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD, then Jesus' words that "he who stands firm to the end will be saved" would no longer be applicable after 70 ("the end"), which is clearly not reasonable given the intense persecution that would be unleashed on Christians in the Roman empire over the next 300 or so years.

I think Jesus is answering the disciples last question first: "What will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?" (24:3)

That's why he starts with a warning to "watch out that no one deceives you". Nation rising against nation and kingdom against kingdom would be the "beginning of birth pains" - of which the Jewish uprising and eventual desolation was one.

Good thoughts Kolkata.  I don't think I've welcomed you to our family - so welcome!!  Glad to have you.

One of the points I was trying to make was that at Matthew 24:14 the preaching message is the "good news of the Kingdom" and this was a message that the disciples had already started proclaiming while Jesus was yet on earth.   Now I don't believe the Bible specifically answers this but it could be speculated three progressive Kingdom Messages:

1. The Kingdom has drawn near. (During Jesus ministry)
2. Jesus has been crowned king of the Kingdom and given all authority.  (Just after Jesus ascension.)
3. SPECULATIVE - Jesus is ready take charge of the Kindoms of the Earth.  (The time of the end?)
   

However, it stands that no matter what time period you live in the kingdom message needs to be proclaimed and Christians should be preaching it.   The details of the message may change depending on the time period but it always essentially the same - Jesus is Lord of God's Kingdom.

I'm glad you brought up Revelation 14:6.   It is a fascinating scripture.   How do we view this "angel flying in midheaven"?   At first glance it would seem that this gospel work is being filled by a spirit creature.    Of course we could also translate angel as "messenger" but then would would we make of the flying part.  (The flying nun?  :D  Kidding.)

I have to agree with Anthony.

I don't see how one can think that Matthew 28:19, 20 and Matthew 24:14 have different applications. Matthew 28:19, 20 is not more general. It, in fact, has greater specificity, mentioning baptism. Matthew 24:14 is more general, though it does tell us what the message is about (the kingdom). There is no reason to believe that the good news of the kingdom is not being talked about in Matt 28 also.

Would you say that the Roman Empire constituted "all creation" in Colossians 1:23?

Plus, if you argue that Matt 24:14 did not have any fulfillment before 70 CE, then you are arguing that parts of the prophecy, even before we get to verse 29, were never fulfilled back then. Do you really believe that?

That all depends on what Christians are said to be "saved" from. There are plenty of things to be saved from, right? One can be saved from all sorts of instances of disaster, persecution, etc. You seem to be taking Matt 10:22 to mean that all Christians would be saved from any and all persecutions forever and ever. But it is talking about something specific. Who is Jesus speaking to in this passage? The twelve (10:5). That is who this comment is directed toward. So it must have an application within their lifetime.

Hi donbodo

Not especially - I think Paul was using a figure of speech. For instance, in the next chapter, Paul says: "He forgave us all our sins, having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross. And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross." (2:13-15)

No written code was actually nailed to the cross, neither were the powers and authorities literally disarmed and spectactled.

Nevertheless, Paul is using a figure of speech to demonstrate the true power of Jesus' blood over the Law, and the "powers and authorities" of this world, be they Roman or otherwise.

So I believe Paul is using a figure of speech in reference to his comment that "he has reconciled you by Christ's physical body through death" - this gospel was proclaimed to all "every creature under heaven" upon Jesus' death, in the same way that the powers and authorities were disarmed.

I am arguing that the prophecy from verses 4 to 14 were a summary of what must take place before the end of the world age.

It began to have its fulfillment in 33CE. The Roman empire was not the whole world, which explains why Romans could periodically go to war against other nations that were not part of their empire.

Jesus said to his disciples: "Go and make disciples of all nations... I am with you always, to the very end of the age." (Mathew 28:20) Was he with them until the end of the Jewish system, and then no longer? Of course not - so he must have meant a different age.

So when Jesus said, "And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come"... I believe he was referring to the end of the world age.

Yes, Jesus' comments were directed towards the twelve, but why must it have had an application within their lifetime? These are the same people who asked,

"Lord, are you going to free Israel now and restore our kingdom?" (Acts 1:6)

Jesus had given them how many illustrations of the king going away for a long time... and here they are asking him if he was going to free Israel now!

In other words: the apostles asked their questions, believing everything in the world related to them, as Jews. But that was not necessarily Jesus' view!...

... which was why Jesus had to say to them:

"The Father sets those dates... and they are not for you to know. But when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, you will receive power and will tell people about me everywhere-in Jerusalem, throughout Judea, in Samaria, and to the ends of the earth." (Acts 1:7,8)

Hmmmm good question!

Now, Matt 24 is a wonderful chapter, full of things that are yet too, or are developing as we speak.  So, imho, this particular "good news of the Kingdom" is yet future, a specific message for a purpose in time.

So the question begs, What do we do now?  Love for God and Christ well up in us!  We have to let the fruitage out!!!!  We do this by sharing what we have with others.  Now, I must say, I have hope to be granted to do this is an amazing way, with the Grace of God. If we don't will not the stones cry out?

So until we recieve a specific message, We can share what we have with each other and whomever will listen.  The Apostle Paul showed us in a fantastic way, what message we can share.  One of hope, restoration, and life.... Jesus.  

I mean, once we have come to such a wonderful realization of the gift we have been given,,.. How can we bury it?  We just want to share it with others.  I pray our Father will let us do this.

love to all:heartbeat::grouphug:
Lynn

My perspective is this -

When Jesus told his disciples, "this good news of the kingdom will be preached", how would they have understood what he meant by "this good news"?

Wouldn't it stand to reason that they would have understood it to be the same "good news of the Kingdom" that they had just spent the last three years preaching? I can't see within the recorded discussion of Matthew 24 that Jesus is suddenly bringing to the plate a different "good news of the Kingdom".

And Jesus wasn't?

It's interesting how you determine whether someone is using a figure of speech. If you find him using another figure of speech somewhere in the near vicinity, then you can claim that the expression under discussion is also figurative. That's interesting, because Matthew 24 has several figures of speech in it.

Hmmm. So they are a summary, not of what will happen just before the end of the age, but a summary of the history of thousands of years before the end of the age?

The Roman empire itself was made up of many nations. You seem to be assuming it itself consisted of only one nation. "All nations" could mean "all nations of the empire" or "all known nations," or could be a figure of speech, as Paul used.

Regarding your question, I will ask you a similar one, and the answer is the same: Will Jesus be with us only until the end of the world system, and then no longer?

Regarding your comments on the Twelve, I am not persuaded by an argument that says that since "everything in the world" didn't apply to the Twelve, then nothing Jesus said applies to only them either. That's not logical.

I thought this was interesting. This is my local newspaper..


http://www.recordonline.com/apps/pbcs.dl.../702260331

:D

Not necessarily... They really didn't understand "the Kingdom" and all its implications until after Christs death.  So at the time Jesus was speaking with them..."this Good New of The Kingdom" was somewhat ambigious.

Then, after the spirit was poured out, They finally understood their message, Christ and drawing all things to him.  They were given the ability to transfer spirit into others for their benefit... fruitage.

So, because Jesus gave us signs of the conclusion of the system of things, then he added the extra description of the message, it seems, at least to me, that it would not be a continuous message, such as we have experienced for hundreds of years, but a more specific event.

Just my two cents worth
Love
lynn

:clap: Hi Anthony!! :clap:

I believe the preaching work that Christ commissioned will be the same from his ascention until the full manifestation of Gods Kingdom. A favourite scripture of mine is here -->

"That is why, since we have this ministry according to the mercy that was shown us , we do not give up; 2 but we have renounced the underhanded things of which to be ashamed, not walking with cunning, neither adulterating the word of God, but by making the truth manifest recommending ourselves to every human conscience in the sight of God" -- 2 Corinthians 4:1-2

While I have lots of work to do, and am far from perfect -- I have come to understand, that the more we are refined through fire and remain focused on the foundation, which is Truth -- the more we are able to reflect in like manner the 'mercy that was shown us', through our 'ministry'! 'Renouncing the underhanded things', correlates to 'strip off the Old Personality', imo. By not giving up, we can, with help from the Spirit of Truth -- make the Truth manifest! -- showing the Truth to every Life Force in Jahs sight!!

I know this wasnt quite related to Matthew, but I wanted to show that our preaching work -- is going to have the same underlying message, yesterday, now, tomorrow -- whenever!!

Its that of the Spirit of freedom!! That of the Way! That of the real Life!! That of Truth!! The Truth that all mankind have been shown mercy from the Father and Son -- who love them unconditionally!! The message of the Ransom!! Christ, has not only been raised from the dead, but he is the King -- the Light in a world soaked in darkness!! Moved by the Spirit, we can show people who are around us, through the Appreciation and grace that has been given us -- the true meaning of Love!! Love fulfills the Law -- Love is the fabric of Truth -- Love is what Jehovah is!!

:yahoo: Sounds like timeless good news to me!! :yahoo:

May LOVE be with you!

your bro -- beau! :friends::friends::friends:

I think it is like the river in Ezekial 47. It was flowing in the days of Jesus but the flow became greater when Jesus poured out the Holy Spirit. Eventually it will be impossible to go agaist the flow.
The word I think is exponential.
In Rev. 22:17, those who hear will say come and I assume those who heard and came to the water will also be shouting 'come!'
So even the growth will grow.
We should all find ways to preach and show our willingness, but there will be a time when Jehovah will multiply our success.

vicky

Anthony is right in pointing out that Jesus says "this" good news, rather than "that" good news. He is referring to the gospel that his disciples actually were taught, not something else or something more. So I have to disagree that he was referring to an ambiguous message or to one that had not been given yet. They knew what the good news of the kingdom was.

Remember what Paul said:

"Even if we or an angel out of heaven were to declare to YOU as good news something beyond what we declared to YOU as good news, let him be accursed. As we have said above, I also now say again, Whoever it is that is declaring to YOU as good news something beyond what YOU accepted, let him be accursed (Gal. 1:8-9).

Hello Donbodo... Dare I point out that Paul was talking about this after the death of Christ..

I really liked Vicky's point;

We should be shouting Come!  And I really look forward to the time when our Father will cause our fruitage to multiply beyond all our wildests hopes.  Soon perhaps?

Prov. 21:31 "the horse is made ready for the day of battle, but victory rests with the Lord."
Love
Lynn