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I know this is a subject that witnesses avoid.
I have had a number of strange encounters with the spirit world but try not to make a fuss about it.
Today and yesterday has been a strange time.
One of my tenants tried to commit suicide, and a couple of others have borrowed money.
Well this evening one of the borrowers said he would pay me the change or disappear into town to spend it. He was joking and being cheeky.

He suddenly said what was that?

He said something clipped him round the head.

Well the guy who is feeling depressed is home and we hopefully will watch that he doesn't do something daft. I think this depression is over a scabby old bat. Poor guy!

Hi there Vicki ... :heartbeat:

You know I did the same to my children when they gave me a cheeky remark :P
My grandfather always said that light smacks behind the head would improve someones intelligence :P ;)

I look at these types of affirmations as a wake up call to the one experiencing these things ... I have heard of many stories like these from friends etc ... and some of these types of occurances happened to me too when I was young ... especially the calling of my name and no one being there.

I personally was never scared but it made me think and know that there was something more than just what my physical eyes could see.

It made me aware and was the beginnig of my spiritual search for something greater.

Even now being one of Jehovah's witnesses I still cannot just ignor what has happened to me in the past and what is still happening to me today and just throw it all away and dismiss it as something evil.

GOD works in mysterious ways ... and His eyes are everywhere :)

If it was'nt for an angel whispering to me in my ear....my daughter would be dead right now.

They expect you to believe in demons. They also have written about angels protecting them in their witness work in the yearbooks.

If the WT believes in wicked spirits, then they also believe in good angelic spirits.

I believe there are good Angels helping us each day. They watch over us.

The angel of the LORD encamps around those who fear Him, And rescues them. Psalms 34:7

Psalm 91:11 For He will give His angels charge concerning you, To guard you in all your ways.

Daniel 6:22 "My God sent His angel and shut the lions' mouths and they have not harmed me, inasmuch as I was found innocent before Him; and also toward you, O king, I have committed no crime."

Matthew 26:53
53.Do you think I cannot call on my Father, and he will at once put at my disposal more than twelve legions of angels?

There is good reason why the apostle John told us:

"Beloved ones, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they originate with God, because many false prophets have gone forth into the world." -- 1 John 4:1

Long before becoming a committed Christian I had a Catholic boyfriend. I went to his church (when the mass was in Latin) for about 2 years.

Once, during Christmas midnight mass, when there was a procession of the baby Jesus doll and everyone knelt down as it passed, I felt a strong hand on my neck pushing me to my knees. It was not a good feeling and it creeped me out since the hand was invisible.

I've often wondered if anyone else had a similar experience in a church.

I also feel that it's important to remember that, as Paul said in 2 Corinthians 11:14:

"...Satan himself keeps transforming himself into an angel of light. . ."

...it may not always be easy to make a distinction between holy spirit and the other kind.

But that angels assist us is borne out by Hebrews 1:13-14:

"But with reference to which one of the angels has he ever said: “Sit at my right hand, until I place your enemies as a stool for your feet”?  Are they not all spirits for public service, sent forth to minister for those who are going to inherit salvation?"

Love,
Rez:giverose:

So what does this bit mean then....? :dontknow:

Are they not all spirits for public service, sent forth to minister for those who are going to inherit salvation?

Not sure what your question is, Beau.:confused: Please give me a little more dimention to the query, eh?:P

Well.....what does it mean for angels to "minister"?

And what is their "public service"?


Thanks Aunty! :friends::friends::friends:

you it is kind of funny that this scripture came up ... :read::huh:

I was reading this passage a few days ago and got to pondering on it ... :thinking:

I was kind of thinking that it a wee bit ... oh I don't know ... self-serving? ... arrogant ... not sure really what word to use here ... sorry ... :blush: of Paul.

It sort of came across to me that the 'angels are only there to serve 'those who are going to inherit salvation' ... which could to some people come across as 'choosy' as to whom they would 'serve' ... and that this is there only purpose ... :shocked:

I am not being critical here ... but seeking to clarify ...:redface:

If the angels are in our lives ... ministering to us ... or doing public service ... then we do need to be careful that the 'angel' ... or 'spirit' ... is truly of the light ... :innocent: :idea:

And doesn't this very notion then mean that angels are around ...?:dontknow: and that they are there to 'help' ...?

However, just how would they 'show' themselves in this regard ...?

Probably stupid questions ... but I haven't eaten yet ... :eat: and so my brain is probably starving for nourishment and not functioning properly ... so I'll just toddle off to feed it ... :):coffeeread:

Probably should just hit the delete button ... but I am curious as to what ya'll think as well ...

For so long the word 'spirits' has instilled of fear of perhaps searching out more ... and that fear has come from WT doctrines I'm thinking ... because even when you look in our reference materials there isn't much there on angels (spirits) which would IMHO only reinforce the idea that it is kind of a 'taboo' topic ... :shocked:

Anyway, going now ... :P;) really ... ;):siskiss:

Luv as always ... BR :sheepy: :bouncyhearts:

Of course!! This is what I've been trying to get across to some folks here. Every one of us has angels with us at all times, whether we are evil or good. They are waiting for us to acknowledge them! Now it isn't that God can't take care of all of it Himself, he doesn't HAVE to, he has created help!

It's really simple to distinguish between a good spirit and a bad spirit. The good one will offer love and compassion. The bad one will try to instill fear, even if it's only subtle fear. Threatening someone with eternal destruction isn't going to accomplish God's will. It's that simple!

Jimmy C.

Hey, bud :wave: Thanks for clarifying that question.

I think, since this is more of an experiential sort of thread, following Vicky's lead, my answer may be more of a combination of what I've learned from the bible and my personal experience with angels.

First of all, aside from my simple faith as a child, I pretty much came into a period of agnosticism. Throughout my teens and early twenties I believed there was a God who created all the wonders around me but I didn't believe that the bible was inspired by him. Neither did I believe in the existence of angels, including the devil. Any prayers that I sent His way just got lost in space -- at least, it felt that way to me.

But I searched for the truth about God just the same. Who knows to what extent angels affected my life during those years. Here I was, on a spiritual quest but without any spiritual consciousness. Does that sound weird and contradictory?:P

At my worst during that time, I was experimenting with mind altering drugs and was confused and close to suicide. The only thing that stopped me from ending it all was the horrible thought that it wouldn't BE the end - that the mental agony would continue even after my death, and I would be helpless to stop it. That was HELL! :devil:

Making a long story short, when I was humbled down to the ground, I was rescued by our Lord Jesus and was reborn from above and given the gift of understanding God's Word. It was really exciting to open the bible and comprehend what it was saying. I got everything that day. Now I knew my God was there with his Son and all the angels...a whole heaven full of beings!

From that time on I was aware of angels in my life. They were the dispensers of God's holy spirit. They strengthened me spiritually and led me to scripture and then opened my eyes to the meaning....I swear they bolded some of the text! I felt their joy as this sinner (me) repented. They were God's comfort to me in prayer and they kept me focused on Jesus. In short, they were connectors!:grouphug:

This all ties in with how I see these messengers in scripture. They are ministers.....just as our Lord Jesus came to minister to others.

"Just as the Son of man came, not to be ministered to, but to minister and to give his soul a ransom in exchange for many.” --Matthew 20:28

But even Jesus needed the ministry of angels.

"Then the Devil left him, and, look! angels came and began to minister to him." -- Matthew 4:11

We, too, need to minister to each other. It seems that the whole universe of intelligent beings is there to minister to others to the glory of God, our greatest giver!

If we fail to do this,

"Then he will say, in turn, to those on his left, ‘Be on YOUR way from me, YOU who have been cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the Devil and his angels. For I became hungry, but YOU gave me nothing to eat, and I got thirsty, but YOU gave me nothing to drink. I was a stranger, but YOU did not receive me hospitably; naked, but YOU did not clothe me; sick and in prison, but YOU did not look after me.’ Then they also will answer with the words, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison and did not minister to you?’ Then he will answer them with the words, ‘Truly I say to YOU, To the extent that YOU did not do it to one of these least ones, YOU did not do it to me.’ And these will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the righteous ones into everlasting life.” -- Matthew 25:41-46

We are also enjoined to minister to the Christ.

"If anyone would minister to me, let him follow me, and where I am there my minister will be also. If anyone would minister to me, the Father will honor him." -- John 12:26

"....strengthen your brothers.. . ." -- Luke 22:32 is one way we minister to our Lord.

This is how the angels minister too.

"Then an angel from heaven appeared to him and strengthened him." -- Luke 22:43

In my own experience I've found that angels of God are: happy,:) have a great sense of humor,:D are modest, humble and loyal.:redface: They will stand by you in difficult times:hug: and rejoice to share the remarkably good times with you.:friends: They will even sing with you.:birds: They stay out of the limelight, but, like good friends, are there to rout for you to succeed.:cheer:

I am convinced that angels enjoy their assignments and we probably don't know but a particle of what-all they do besides ministering to us. That's a big ole universe out there, eh?

Love ya, "little" nephew,:love:
Aunty rez

Hi all,
To be quite frank, I think threads like this are dangerous.

We are giving too much attention to the activity of demons. We all may have had bad 'experiences' in our lives, but retelling demon experiences increases their importance in our life and concentrates our mind on the wrong focal point. The Lord Jesus Christ is where our eyes should be fixed.

When I became a Christian, I was liberated by knowing Christ walked with me and the unhealthy witness concentration on the demons was banished.

May the peace of Christ be with you all always.
Derek

I'm not sure I completely agree with you there Derek. I agree that the WT teaches an over reaching fear of demons but Jesus certainly dealt with the subject in an open and very obvious way. Instead of Jesus being frightened of Demons he approached the man called legion when all others were frightened. No fear at all. He also said he saw Satan fall as lightning from heaven and gave power over demons to his apostles. One thing Jesus didn't do was avoid talking about it. So it seems to me that fixing our eyes on Jesus means trying to be as like him as possible, which means we also as his children talk about it, but without fear unlike the watchtower.

My life was saved via my angel amid an absolute situation of demonic interference. Few would or could believe what happened to me, but one thing was clear about my situation, and that was God through a simple angelic messenger thwarted the plans of highly powerful sinister beings who wanted me dead. The circumstances they manipulated would make any 9/11 conspiracy theory look like a child's toy in comparison, yet I also saw Satan fall from heaven as lightning as it were. In other words I am here because I decided to heed the messengers warning and escaped, literally. Without the enemy it would be hard to learn to hear the good. Not talking about these things is not an option in my book because these things are real, and so is God and his angels. Far from being frightened its realistic and hopeful because it means Jesus is still with us today and its all real and fear is of the past. I find that faith strengthening in a world where people cant believe what they cant see and who don`t want to talk about it. Perhaps also its a case that they cant see because they cant believe.

All the more reason it's in the Controversy room, bro.

We who? are giving too much attention to the activity of demons?

The bible speaks about the activities of demons, especially around the time of Christ. As we approach the time of his second coming, do you not think it timely to discuss how to distinguish between clean and unclean spirits? What does Paul say at 1 Timothy 4:1-5,

"The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth. For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer." (NIV)

Tell me, bro: What spirit was Paul following when when he murderously persecuted our brothers in the Lord? D'ya think Paul was glad to get to know the difference between clean and unclean spirits?

And it was not always easy to discern the difference. I think of this experience of Paul's when he met up with a servant girl possessed of an unclean spirit.

"One day on our way to the place of prayer, we were met by a slave girl. She had a spirit in her that gave her the power to tell the future. By doing this she made a lot of money for her owners. The girl followed Paul and the rest of us and kept yelling, "These men are servants of the Most High God! They are telling you how to be saved."

This went on for several days. Finally, Paul got so upset that he turned and said to the spirit, "In the name of Jesus Christ, I order you to leave this girl alone!" At once the evil spirit left her." -- Acts 16:16-18 (Contemporary English Version)

Even though Paul had the power to cast out this spirit from day one, it was a tricky situation. What the girl was saying was absolutely true. It took Paul several days to discern where this was going to go.

Jesus also gave instruction on this topic.

"When an unclean spirit comes out of a man, it goes through arid places seeking rest and does not find it. Then it says, 'I will return to the house I left.' When it arrives, it finds the house swept clean and put in order. Then it goes and takes seven other spirits more wicked than itself, and they go in and live there. And the final condition of that man is worse than the first." -- Luke 11:24-26 (NIV)

That is good, Derek. But that doesn't mean that this important topic should not be discussed. It's probably long overdue. The problem that the WT had with demons is that people went from one extreme of phobic fear of them to the other - of not really taking it seriously - in fact, many didn't really have much comprehension of the spirit realm. Let's try to be balanced about this subject, eh?;)

love,
rez:siskiss:

Hi Rez,
We shall just have to beg to differ on this subject.
I am not speaking from ignorance.

BTW, It is odd that women appear to more aware of demonic presences than men?

Undoubtedly evil exists in this world of ours, but the presence of Christ is truly liberating and life affirming.

Having read the words of Paul quite a bit I think I know where the centre of his spiritual focus lay.
Regarding his 'encounters'; in Paul's case his desire was to do battle in Christ power and it was certainly not due to an unhealthy voyeuristic fascination. :)
I think when discussing this subject we should ask ourselves where we are placed between those two poles. That, I think, is where balance comes in.

shalom
Derek

Good evening all ... :hibye:

Dear br. Derek ... your response to this even 'touching' of the topic shows me how deep is our fear of speaking about 'spirits' ... and why I have tended to steer clear of such topics when they have been brought up ...

However, I am sure that you would agree that not all spirits are demons my brother ...? :devil:

If 'spirits' were not to touch our lives in any way then why are we told to 'test them out' ...? :dontknow::read:

1 John 4:1 ...

Test the Spirits

1Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.

Angels, angels back in Bible times, have always been very active with humans, directly and indirectly ... and so why would we not think that they would be so today ... and maybe even more so when the war in heaven occurs and demonic activity will greatly increase as the scriptures say ... 'woe to earth and sea for the Devil has come down to you' ...?

So, to avoid speaking lovingly, openly,honestly and in balance about the this topic may not necessarily be a good thing ...

How is speaking about it taking away Christ from the focal point of our lives? :dontknow:

Haven't we be warned to stay awake and keep our senses? If indeed there will be a period when 'teachings of demons' ... from themselves and their followers, will become the 'norm' ... then we should know 'something' about how to identify them ... how we can 'oppose' them and 'test' them ... expecially as they will by 'tricky' in their deceit as they will appear to be 'angels of light' ...

If there were no 'angels of light' that we would be able to identify then we would have no fear of being deceived by such oneswho 'claim' to be such as they wouldn't have any 'sway' over us ...

Angels ARE around us ... the scriptures clearly say so ... and that they are around us doing Jehovah's and Jesus' work on our behalf ...

Not to acknowledge them ... or to even 'FEED' them ...

Heb. 13:2 ...

2Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so doing some people have entertained angels without knowing it.

... would be to me to devalue them and not give them the respect that they deserve for all their hard work.

Do we not give respect and honor to men ... to people in positions of responsibility (judges, kings, queens etc.) ... and so it wouuld seem ignorant of us not to acknowledge their position in Jehovah's spiritual family and that they are doing an important work even though we may not always know what it may be?

From what I have experienced and seen I know that we are all an INTERCONNECTED PART of the WHOLE family ... visible and invisible ... but that we are not as connected as we could be and will be in the future to come ... :grouphug::grouphug:

Hope that some of this makes sense ... :giverose:

May we all have the love and peace of God that excels all thought!! :thumbsup:

Luv BR :sheepy: :bouncyhearts: