I was reading Mark heber millers biography a while back, he mentioned how he was shooting a martial arts piece, and had free lessons, he mentioned an experience where after a while of martial arts training, he had focused his chi and used it to strike someone, after this he realised the dangers and backed off from it.
What do you think of this, in martial arts it has a lot to do with breathing and concentration, it is refered to as the energy which everything is made of, and something which can be controlled concentrated and manipulated.
In the bible we have, pneuma, ruach, spirit, it is referred to as breath energy and power, I believe this is the true "ki" , its something which exists only by Jehovah's power.
Every breath we breathe is from him, it is by his spirit we live and breathe even tho we are a fallen race.
Perhaps these occultists and even some non occultist have learned to control their spirit, martial artists even runners have awareness of need to control breathing and themselves, this all is related to pnuema, now within ourselves we have "spirit" But as christians we seek strength of the Holy Spirit, not the fallen spirit within us.
The posts by Jeshurun about "magic" remind me of this, perhaps it is possible to do certain things, however as christians we rely not on our own ki, spirit or power, but on that of God, by this we are refined and strengthened, guided.
The chi control of the world may resemble this to a degree but it is different, I don't believe thay are all demonized,or this can be done only by demons, however a demon can help one to menipulate their own chi, and can, if one allows, control and dominate a persons energy thereby possesing them.
Now to learn to control ourselves and breathing is not wrong as long as we realise every breath we take is possible by God, and we rely not on the flesh or our own strength or fallen spirit, but his.
If we rely on ourselves, than it can truly be as jesh said "black magic" if we rely on God, it isn't magic at all but the power beyond what is normal to endure and serve him rightly.
It is very interesting that all the ancient wise cultures have a word very similar to ruach or pneuma, ki, chi, or whatever they call it, but only through Gods word can one learn the way to truly harness the Holy Pneuma.
I think they're principles are true but dangerous if not understood in light of the bible, mark millers (friends of the nazerene) experience being just one of many.
Good post, SOJ!! :clap:
While I see the point you are making -- one has to ask >
Who's "chi" is it anyway?
Its all God's. Everything belongs to Him. So perhaps it can be as simple as remembering WHO's it is, and giving reverence where reverence is due.
I like to "delve" into energy, energy Law, energy "flow", and I dont consider any of it to be demonic, though, I do have my boundaries as to what I do and dont do. The scriptures are FULL of parabolic statements about energy, energy Law and energy "flow". Even a glimpse into the field of Quantum Physics can show one that there is more than meets the eye.
But again -- to me, its all God. It all belongs to Him, and so with Him in mind, I go about my business.
Cheers buddy!! :friends::friends::friends:
This is a thread I am very interested in. My field of study & work (homeopathy) has much to say about the "life force". I am in transition of thought between reconciling my homeopathic philosophy, science, WT teachings & Christian Bible based beliefs.I would appreciate a long conversation on this.
I have experienced homeopathy going over to the dark side , so to speak, with the use of radionics, I got bad vibes at school on that demo.It was interesting when doing my research on the WT to find the radiobola machine in their past.Anyone having time to add scans or links of this would be much appreciated.
However my school year is not over yet & I'll be too busy to comment till after Tuesday.
Looking forward to everyones thoughts, till then.
Blithe
Hi Soldier.. Interesting!
Let's go back to Eden here. I think diffently than the JW's about the spirit that was breathed into Adam. They think this was the impersonal force or spirit that keeps the body alive. I believe that it was the 'holy spirit' that was breathed into Adam. (Funny, how there is no mention of Eve recieving it). I also believe that when he was thrown out of the garden, that he had the holy spirit removed from him, thus still having the 'spirit', that kept his body animated. So we can see 2 different spirits here that man could have. There could be still more, if one was possessed by entities. So I think the 'holy spirit' is diffent from the 'spirit'.
I have also been contemplating lately what the situation will be on Christ's return for the ones who 'had pierced him' and the ones who recieved the 'mark of the beast'. These ones, on Christ's return are in a scary situation, as was the Rich Man in the Richman and Lazarus story. To me, its a place wthout God's spirit or protection, similiar to being exited from Eden.
You said we had a fallen spirit. I don't think our spirit is fallen. Our flesh, on the other hand is weak by it's very nature. Even Adam's flesh longed for approval and closeness to Eve and evidently this lead to his downfall. So I really don't think our flesh or spirit has fallen but rather since the exodus from Eden, we are without God's spirit unless we recieve it from God and Jesus as our token of salvation. And having the holy spirit helps us to get our flesh under control.
As far as Karate, magic, tarot, etc., I am wondering this: If we are tapped into God's spirit, then maybe the spirit we use would be God's, but if we are surrounded by wicked spirits, then the spirit could get an evil influence as you brought out.
In the scriptures, the high priests' garb had a pocket for lots. So when the lots were cast, they were assured that it would be God answering the request. But in the Book of Jonah, as well as another place in the OT, pagan men cast lots to find answers to problems. Now this tells me that casting lots were a common practice for different religions, yet were all requests answered by the true God? Evidently not, if they were a wicked person. So, my conclusion is that it wasn't the practice that was/is wrong (unless it has a demonic twist) but the individual himself that determined whether the answers would be from God or Satan/demons. What do you say? Interested in your viewpoint.
It is very interesting that all the ancient wise cultures have a word very similar to ruach or pneuma, ki, chi, or whatever they call it, but only through Gods word can one learn the way to truly harness the Holy Pneuma.
Hi SoJ! :siskiss:
I don't think we can 'harness' it or control it - if it is truly God's spirit then it is always a case of Him using it to control and guide us.
I think many people have this notion, once smitten by the spirit, they then thinks it's theirs and emanates from them and they get prideful and arrogant - but it's really God working through them by means of His spirit... It should be a humbling experience... imho.
We can make ourselves and our surroundings more hospitable and inviting for God's Spirit - but harness it once it comes? That would be like trying to leash the wind! :no:
Fitty cents worth, lol
:peace:
What I mean by harnessing and controlling our chi, is that, there is a spirit we all have a breath an energy even the rottenest of rotten have it, it reminds us that we all breathe by Gods grace, with this spirit we can do what we wish to a degree, for example the Demons were able to make offspring with there own energy transforming into flesh and using there power to breed, a fallen spirit in that we tend to drift towards the wrong uses.
To show there are two different spirits, one which can be controlled to submit to another, Paul for example mentions it many times, the Spirit bears witness with our spirit, the old man the new man, war in members, if we subject ourselves to controlling ourselves ourselves without God, as the runner, the martial artist than we do the wrong thing.
The martial artists say that we have chi and the unlimited full chi comes from the universe they say when we breathe we take in chi, when we (as men) have an emission, there is chi leaving the body (power to make life expending your own chi)(which explains why fighters today don't have intercourse before a fight in part, and why in the bible the warriors didn't before a fight also, as this alters energy and hormone).
But as christians we know the source is not the "universe" but God, he created the universe and it has much energy but he is the source.
I believe this is true to a degree for many reasons, Jesus while on earth had full control, even so he recognized his Father as the source of all his wonderful works.
I think there are many things we now know little about such as this and other things, when I can it can be controlled, I mean our own ki, if we try by ourselves we yeild to flesh, but with Gods help we yeild to the Ruach Hakodesh (Holy Spirit).
Hey Blithe Freshman!! :clap:
Hows it going matey? :thumbsup:
This is a thread I am very interested in. My field of study & work (homeopathy) has much to say about the "life force". I am in transition of thought between reconciling my homeopathic philosophy, science, WT teachings & Christian Bible based beliefs.I would appreciate a long conversation on this.
I have experienced homeopathy going over to the dark side , so to speak, with the use of radionics, I got bad vibes at school on that demo.It was interesting when doing my research on the WT to find the radiobola machine in their past.Anyone having time to add scans or links of this would be much appreciated.
However my school year is not over yet & I'll be too busy to comment till after Tuesday.
Looking forward to everyones thoughts, till then.
Blithe
Thanks for your thoughts.
Ita great to hear you work in Homeopathy -- I have a few friends who also work in Homeopathy. I work in Personal Development, as an NLP Coach -- just finished completing the Master Practitioner course (also includes Time-Line Therapy and Hypnotherapy). I also see Life Force energy as being intergral in NLP coaching -- in fact, I think its intergral in pretty much everything people do. We work with both the unconscious mind and conscious mind to get results -- so we definitely do acknowledge a person's energy in the process.
I just did a quick wikipedia check on Radionics -- and was wondering what exactly freaked you out and gave you bad vibes -- was it the feeling that there were spirits involved in the process?
Just interested in hearing your perspective.
Im a fan of Don Tolman myself, and have been slowly reverting to a Whole Foods diet ever since going to one of his seminars. Its amazing to think that God provided us with EVERYTHING we need naturally -- of course. Knowledge seems to be the key though. Knowing what to eat, or use and for what.
Looking forward to hearing your views. :thumbsup:
Cheers matey!! :friends::friends::friends:
I just did a quick wikipedia check on Radionics -- and was wondering what exactly freaked you out and gave you bad vibes -- was it the feeling that there were spirits involved in the process?
Just interested in hearing your perspective.
Looking forward to hearing your views. :thumbsup:
Cheers matey!! :friends::friends::friends:[/color]
Hi,
I think I being conditioned by the WT was spooked because radionics is considered a devining tool. Much of my uncomfortableness came from that. I was cautious at school, being thrown in with many who practiced alternative therapies and lifestyles.It was a great group of people but sometimes maybe too open minded for me.I was no longer a meeting attender & had many doubts about the org at that time. But still under the influence to not question that sort of teaching.Now that I am free from all that , I do want to research these things related to my work, not spiritism in general.
It is hard for me to tell if it was my own fears or a presence. I also think that while under the influence of the WT , I often felt or saw a presence when I would first be pulling away over something.I was not neccessarily doing something unbibical at the time, more pulling away from the society.From my experiences , I believe the demons were trying to scare me back towards the WT at times. So I don't assume the feelings would be that demons were there because of the radionics , but could have been there to scare me back towards the WT.
The idea of a person being possibly body , spirit, & soul is new to me & I haven't had enough time to consider what the life force is.I had always tried to fit it in with WT dogma.
The other reservation I have with radionics is it removes much of the personal people relationship from the consultation.many of the spin off therapies, that came about in the 20's were money saving to the practitioner, sort of speed & cost cutting. They do not have the track record of success that classical homeopathy has.The people I've studied with have all been leaders in the field and they are all classical teachers.. I am a student of my teachers philosophy.
Let me read some more & give this some thought.
BF