Paradise Cafe Discussions - A Place For Bible Research And Christian Encouragement

Good morning all ... :hibye::grouphug::giverose:

I had someone point out something to me from the Scriptures and I wanted to run it by ya'll to see how you might be able to help in 'giving an answer', if there is one to give ... ;):whistle:

The Scripture is in Gen. 1:26,27 ...

26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, like us: and let him have rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the air and over the cattle and over all the earth and over every living thing which goes flat on the earth.
27 And God made man in his image, in the image of God he made him: male and female he made them.

I have been pondering over this question for a few days now and thinking on the conversation involved and will try to put down some of my thought processes ... scary I know ... :shocked::funnyface:

Ok I look up the Hebrew word for 'man' and it is ...

'âdâm aw-dawm'

From H119; ruddy, that is, a human being (an individual or the species, mankind, etc.): - X another, + hypocrite, + common sort, X low, man (mean, of low degree), person.

In Gen. 9:6 we see the same word used as in Gen. 1:26,27, and it would make sense that it is not just applying to the 'male' of the species, but rather to all of mankind that he had created as our God values the lives of EVERYONE not just the 'male' ... ;)

(BBE) Whoever takes a man's life, by man will his life be taken; because God made man in his image.

Sooooooooooooo, now to the question ... finally ...

If God said he created man IN 'OUR' IMAGE or LIKENESS ... and then he went on to say in reference to that 'image' or 'likeness' ... 'male AND FEMALE ... wouldn't it make sense that there had to be females in heaven?

I thought of our 'history' in regards to mythology when it speaks of women 'gods' (angels that forsook their natural dwelling place) with great powers and wondered if perhaps their might be something more to his question ...

The first scripture that came to mind to show that the Bible says that the angels are male, or at least 'one gender' is the account where the scribes and Pharisees tried to trick Jesus ...

Matt. 22:30 ...

(BBE) For when they come back from the dead there are no husbands and wives, but they are as the angels in heaven.

When I reread this verse I noticed that it wasn't describing the 'sex' of angels, but only the 'marrying' of angels ... and maybe they don't 'marry' like we do if there are 'female' angels ... we really don't know that much about what really goes in heaven do we as 'fleshly' creations ...? :dontknow:

Anyway, I am now in the process of going through my concordance to see if there is anything specific on this topic ...

I also thought about the objection of saying the scriptures always seem to be in the 'male' context ... SON of man for example ... but do we not use 'brothers' or 'brotherhood' to denote ALL of God's people, both the men and the women ...?:dontknow:

Anyway, that is where I'm at right now ... gotta go and do some sweeping and cleaning ... I hope that ya'll will be able to help me out a wee bit!:giverose:

Luv and thanks in advance ... your sis BR :sheepy: :bouncyhearts:

Interesting topic BR :giverose:

Well I'm inclined to believe that The Word was begotten from God & that Eve being taken from Adam pictures this, but, what makes this idea really interesting is that the word translated wisdom in Proverbs 8 is chokmah, which is
a feminine noun..
:thinking:

So, maybe The Word or pre/post human Yeshuwa is kinda like YHWH's feminine side!

Agape Johnny :heartbeat:

well now :hibye: just off the top of my head. a dangerous place actually :blush: I am thinking how could there not be--especially when I think of the chorus of heavenly voices--imagine no beautiful high notes--it just wouldn't be right :cheekkiss:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9X3x2a13Mo

(whatever...grin)

Hi BR,

The angels are actually considered to be feminine, even though they are neither male nor female. I understand that the angels do pair up, but it is more along the lines of contrasting personalities. Just as we may be attracted to a particular type of personality, so it is like that with the angels. I understand that the pairing is for eternity. So, there are no women angels in heaven, but the qualities that they display are more closely related to what we would call feminine. I also know that they are ready, willing and able to help any of us spiritually, should we have need of it.

Paul

and Gogh is being baaad :coolmusic::piano:

Where does it say that they are neither male nor female in presence? Because to me, just because there are times that they appear in male forms, it doesn't mean that all of the legions of the angelic host are male since they have no true bodily form?

====================================================
Steam: I suspect there is no sexual gender among the spirit beings. Remember the scripture that says: They neither marry nor are they given in marriage; but are as the angels of God in heaven.
(Matt. 22:30)
Spirit beings do not reproduce their own kind. Each has ben created individually. God is an "IT", all spifrit beings are "ITS". No sexual division.
Adam was that way when created, an "IT". God divided him into two persons so that he could reproduce. Thus the family was created.

Great thread BR!:thumbsup: He created them 'hu(man), man and wo(man) and that fits all of man(kind) doesn't it? We aren't actually in God's image physically, are we? Therefore we have to be in His image spiritually, emotionally and mentally.:dontknow: There are male and female in all His creation, so why not the same with the angels?:angelnot: It certainly would make life in heaven an interesting place to be, don't you think?:read::cheer:I hope someone comes up with some good research on this.:coffeeread::thumbsup:
Agape,
Sis Grateful

Is there any place you can think of where an angel ever appeared in female form or addressed as a she or her?

The purpose of gender amongst humans and animals is for reproduction purposes... angels (actually just one of the beings that make up the heavens) were each created as individuals and cannot ever multiply and fill anything. This is why satan took the tack that he did to overtake the human race... by encouraging the "SONS of God" to look down on the daughters of men and take them as wives in Genesis 6. Now, do you suppose these were lesbian angels? And just how would they procreate? They materialized in a human form and always male, but that does not make them male... had they manifested themselves in human female form and copulated with men, the humans would have been the stronger side, the dominating factor and the nephilim would not have been giants at all. This appears to me to be another one of those questions that take folks away from much more important issues and subjects.... but it is far better than asking Jesus to fix your toilet

:heartbeat:

The angles are nether male or female. The Male and Female are unique to humans. Male and Female is for the purpose to bring forth according to their kind. Angels cant do that because they have no gender. They have both male and female feelings though. May be we all will be like the angles one day. I personally would like to understand the female way of looking at issues. The feminine viewpoint brings balance with feeling rather than logic without feeling.

Interesting topic.
Just gonna talk off the top of my head (brush off the dandruff as necessary, but don't create a snow storm).............

Men and women all have the same bits during their early foetal stages, then hormones take over.
In fact all males start off female. (Ever watched Jurassic Park? They try to keep all the dinosaurs female, but it goes wrong).
The blueprint for male and female bodies is exactly the same. The only difference is hormones.

But then in the foetal stage (about 5-6 weeks) hormones kick in and decide what silly wiggly bits we get.

When we reach puberty, an extra dose of hormones kicks in and creates dramatic changes. Some even hope the silly wigglies, mammaries, or whatever, will grow depending on gender.

So we all start off the same.

I believe Jehovah is both male and female.
When he describes himself as an eagle that lifts its young up on its pinions, it is actually a female eagle that does that.

When we are down and desperate he will fulfill the role of a parent, no matter which gender we need.

So are angels female? Yes of course they run around carrying messages, which is what their name means (messenger).
Can they also be masculine? Yes of course! Don't try appearing to a patriarchal society and giving an important message as a woman!

Why did the demons appear as male humans?
Well like Satan they wanted power, and to have something that only earthly creatures had, the power of procreation, to create a progeny, maybe to take over the earth.

Now what heavenly creature would chose to come to the earth, live with a human creature which snores, thinks he is superior, takes his orders, and then have to go through giving birth?
Sorry joking, but the choice is obvious.

I think spirits, angels, Jehovah, are neither male nor female but encompass all the attributes: Some may show more 'feminine' sides, others more 'masculine' sides. That will be their individuality

As to the heavenly choirs, the castrati powerfully hit high notes, because they received the first wave of hormones but were deprived of the second.

What vocal range do angels have..... who knows? Particularly as sound as we know it requires gaseous atmospheric molecules.
As you all know there is no sound (that our ears can pick up) in space.

Re: "What vocal range do angels have..... who knows?"

They sing solo. (so lo(w)...they can't be heard.)

Then why call the angels in Genesis who came down to have sex with women the "sons of God"? Meaning they were male in nature? So maybe as the sons of God saw the daughters of man fair, the daughters of God saw the men of God ugly? :whistle::P:nerdy: Just Kidding men! :giverose:

But, why make the point of saying the Sons of God, instead of the angels of God? Or the minions or whatever...:thinking:

Hi BR and interesting thoughts here from all,

Women and the feminine nature was a special creation of God to complete the need of man. This female creation is a reflection of man’s need, not God’s nature. Male and female both reflect the image of God and the best qualities of both sexes come from Him.

The angels being created before humans did not need a helper to make them complete as they are a different order of beings who reflect singularly the masculinity of God after his image.

Re female angels - I'm also thinking back to the ancient goddesses Diana, Minerva, Hermes, Ceres and Proserpine etc and how they have maybe merged into christianity and that's why it's common to hear people speak about female angels. The only time I read about angels, they are referred to as he or him in the Bible.

I view Jehovah as male not in the physical sense but as a being who describes himself as he/him and for us to get to know him having the qualities of a good and loving father. Then again he has the feminine side as Isaiah 49:15 says ""Can a mother forget her sucking child...."?
Jesus came in the form of a human man, was revealed to mankind in male form. Again like his father he showed the gentleness of a mother, the qualities, in Matt.23:37 where he referred to himself as a hen gathering her chicks under her wing.

Love,
[/i]Tessa