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Hello friends,

I have been thinking about the idea of the 7 seals, trumpets and bowls or plagues being the same event, only with different titles. For instance, the 1st seal, 1st trump, and the 1st bowl being all the same. I have put them down and am highlighting the simularities. If you have comments, I would be interested.

1st seal: A black horse. It’s rider was holding a pair of scales in his hand.
1st trumpet: Hail and fire mixed with blood, and it was hurled down upon the earth. A third of the earth was burned up, a third of the trees were burned up, and all the green grass was burned up.
1st bowl of anger: Poured his bowl on the land, and ugly and painful sores broke out on the people who had the mark of the beast and worshipped his image.

2nd seal: A fiery red horse. It’s rider was given power to take peace from the earth and to make men slay each other. To him was given a large sword.
2nd trumpet: Something like a huge mountain, all ablaze, was thrown into the sea. A third of the sea turned into blood, a third of the sea turned into blood, a third of the living creatures in the sea died, and a third of the ships were destroyed.
2nd bowl of anger: Poured his bowl on the sea, and it turned into blood like that of a dead man, and every living thing in the sea died.

3rd seal: A black horse. It’s rider was holding a pair of scales in his hand. Then I heard what sounded like a voice among the four living creatures, saying, “A quart of wheat for a day’s wages, and three quarts of barley for a day’s wages, and do not damage the oil and the wine.”
3rd trumpet: A great star, blazing like a torch, fell from the sky on a third of the rivers and on the springs of water, the name of the star is Wormwood. A third of the waters turned bitter, and many people died from the waters that had become bitter.
3rd bowl of anger: Poured his bowl on the rivers and springs of water, and they became blood.

4th seal: A pale horse. It’s rider was named Death, and Hades was following close behind him. They were given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth.
4th trumpet: A third of the sun was struck, and third of the moon, and a third of the star, so that a third of them turned dark. A third of the day was without light, and also a third of the night.
4th bowl of anger: Poured out his bowl on the sun, and the sun was given power to scorch people with fire. They were seared by the intense heat and they cursed the name of God, who had control over these plagues, but they refused to repent and glorify him.

5th seal: Under the altar, the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained. They were given a white robe, and were told to wait a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and brothers who were to be killed and they had been was completed.
5th trumpet and the 1st woe: A star that had fallen from the sky to the earth. The star was given the key to the Abyss. He let out the locusts. The king over them was the angel of the Abyss.
5th bowl of anger: Poured his bowl on the throne of the beast, and his kingdom was plunged into darkness. Men gnawed their tongues in agony and cursed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, but they refused to repent of what they had done.

6th seal: A great earthquake. The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red, and the stars in the sky fell to earth, as late figs drop from a fig tree when shaken by a strong wind The sky recede like a scroll, rolling up, and every mountain and island was removed from it’s place. The Kings of the earth and all try to hide in the rocks of the mountains, from the wrath of the Lamb.
6th trumpet and the 2nd woe: From the golden altar from before God said: Release the four angels who are bound at the great river Euphrates. And the 4 angels proceeded to kill a third of mankind. The horses and riders I saw in my vision had mouths that fire , smoke and sulfur came out. A third of mankind was killed by the three plagues of fire, smoke and sulfur that came out of their mouths. The rest of mankind did not repent.
Then an angel said the John, to prophesy again about many peoples, nations, languages and kings and eat a little scroll.
Also the 2 witnesses finish their testimony. And the wild beast overpowers them and kills them. And then God raises them from the dead after 3 days. A severe earthquake and a tenth of the city collapses and seven thousand people were killed in the earthquake, and the survivors were terrified and gave glory to the God of Heaven.
6th bowl of angel: Poured out his bowl on the great river Euphrates, and it’s water was dried up to prepare the way for the kings from the East. Then 3 evil spirits that looked like frogs, came out of the mouth of the dragon, out of the mouth of the beast and out of the mouth of the false prophet. The are spirits of demons, performing miraculous works and go the kings of the whole world, gathering them for the war of Armageddon.

4 angels let the winds loose and 144,000 get sealed. A great crowd emerges.

7th seal and 3rd woe: Silence in heaven for about ½ hour.
7th trumpet: “The Kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will reign for ever and ever.” The 24 elders, seated on their thrones before God, fell on their faces, worshipped God, and thanked him. God’s temple in heaven was opened, and within his temple was seen the ark of his covenant. There were flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder, as earthquake and a great hailstorm.
7th bowl of anger: Poured bowl into the air, and out of the temple came a loud voice from the throne, saying, “It is done!” Then flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder and a severe earthquake. The great city divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations collapsed. God gave her the cup filled with the wine of the fury of his wrath. Every island fled away and the mountains could not be found. Huge hailstones of about a hundred pounds each fell upon men. And they cursed God on account of the plague of hail, because the plague was so terrible.

Hiya big sis.

I have wondered about this too Apryl, as there does appear to be, at least some, cross over, but am still not sure..

Agape Johnny

Hi NewTruth

IMHO, no.

A case in point is the third trumpet vs bowl. It is a "third" of the rivers, verses all of the rivers.

Or the fourth trumpet vs bowl is a "third" of the sun, moon and stars being darkened, versus the sun scorching people with fire.

They are definitely related, in that they use similar imagery. For example, throughout scripture, sun, moon and stars are often used as symbols of political luminaries or powers, and their fall usually forebodes the falling of a city, ruler or empire.

I personally believe the third of the sun, moon and stars darkening in the fourth trumpet represented the time just after Nero's death (68CE), when the line of Caesars temporarily ended, and Rome and the Empire plunged into a dangerous civil war, which only ended after three short-lived emperors, and Vespasian gained rulership - all during the time Jerusalem was being beseiged during the tribulation. (These events are all reported by Josephus, and every student of the Bible should make themselves familiar with these events, because I believe not only Jerusalem but events in Rome also fulfilled prophecy.)

On the other hand, the fourth bowl is a later event, poured out as God's wrath upon the people who supported the wild beast, both in its imperial pagan Roman form, and its later Papal form. That territory and people were principally the people of Europe. After Papal Rome, which effectively dominated Europe for over 1,000 years under the "Holy" Roman Empire (an "image" of the former empire) was defeated by Napolean, Europe suffered a series of blows, including revolutions, two World Wars, and brutal dictators who ruled like scorching suns.

I believe a study of the history of Europe and the Middle East reveals the fulfillment of Revelation in exquisite detail.

Thanks sister NewTruth, Good point. I am going to have to think about this. Well spotted and well done. May our fathers spirit be upon you.

Joe

====================================================Steam says: The Revlation began to fulfill son after the visions were given to John. (Rev.1:1)
It journeys trhu the entire time until the Kingdom of Christ is fully empowered and does its work of training the sinners in righteouness.

One seal is broken and then events are shown to happen.(Rev. 6:1,2)
This continues thru the Gospel Age until the seventh seal is broken.(Rev. 8:1)

The seven trumpets sound much later.(Rev. 8:7) First sounds and the Lutheran movement begins, in 15117AD. Then the rebellion by Henry * in England, verses 8 & 9: then Calvin a great star, fell out of the heaven of Christendom. Verse 10 & 11.
Rev. 8:12 The fourth angel sounded and the Baptist movement developed under Simon Mennon. These trumpets sounded in the 16th Century.

Rev. 9:1 The fifth angel sounds and the Methodists movement began in 1728AD.
Rev. 9:13 The sixth angel sounded, and the Bible was released from its storage place in the Church. (1799AD)
Rev. 11:15 The seventh angel sounded in 1874AD The Lord has returned. Jehovah's sovereignty is declared over the earth.

We now have six seals opened, and seven trumpets have sounded. (2008AD) When the seventh seal is opened, all trumpets will have sounded.(Rev. 8:1)

The First Three Plagues are in Rev. 14. Verses 6,7, & the second is in the 8th verse. The third plague is in verses 9, 10, 11. They were in the years about 1876-77 by a few BS.

The "Last Seven Plagues" were given in Pastor Russell's ministry, except for the seventh, which was given after his death. These are the Volume of "Studies In The Scriptures" which Russell wrote.

These were Present Truth to some but plagues to those who refused to accept them as such. It is still that way. These books are filled up with God's wrath! How? Because they explain why God is angry with the human race and what he intends to do about it. No one else has clarified the wrath of God like these books.

Armageddon is NOT a war! It is a condition which the evil spirits, like frogs have gathered the nations into. Kingdom Rendezvous!
See Strong's Concordance. Even today the nations are in alliances which compel them to aid each other when attacked. That is what caused WW1.

Hey Apryl
Hope your well!

While I dont think seals are the same as, or cover the same period as trumpets or bowls, I am beginning to think that the seven trumpets & seven bowls are the same events.

I put together this comparison list with correspondences underlined.

Trumpet 1

And the first one blew his trumpet.
And there occurred a hail and fire mingled with blood, and it was hurled to the earth; and a third of the earth was burned up, and a third of the trees was burned up, and all the green vegetation was burned up.

Bowl 1

And the first one went off and poured out his bowl into the earth.
And a hurtful and malignant ulcer came to be upon the men that had the mark of the wild beast and that were worshiping its image.


Trumpet 2

And the second angel blew his trumpet.
And something like a great mountain burning with fire was hurled into the sea.
And a third of the sea became blood; and a third of the creatures that are in the sea which have souls died, and a third of the boats were wrecked.

Bowl 2

And the second one poured out his bowl into the sea.
And it became blood as of a dead man, and every living soul died, [yes,] the things in the sea.


Trumpet 3

And the third angel blew his trumpet.
And a great star burning as a lamp fell from heaven, and it fell upon a third of the rivers and upon the fountains of waters.
And the name of the star is called Wormwood. And a third of the waters turned into wormwood, and many of the men died from the waters, because these had been made bitter.

Bowl 3

And the third one poured out his bowl into the rivers and the fountains of the waters.
And they became blood. And I heard the angel over the waters say: “You, the One who is and who was, the loyal One, are righteous, because you have rendered these decisions, because they poured out the blood of holy ones and of prophets, and you have given them blood to drink. They deserve it.”
And I heard the altar say: “Yes, Jehovah God, the Almighty, true and righteous are your judicial decisions.”


Trumpet 4

And the fourth angel blew his trumpet.
And a third of the sun was smitten and a third of the moon and a third of the stars, in order that a third of them might be darkened and the day might not have illumination for a third of it, and the night likewise.
And I saw, and I heard an eagle flying in midheaven say with a loud voice: “Woe, woe, woe to those dwelling on the earth because of the rest of the trumpet blasts of the three angels who are about to blow their trumpets!

Bowl 4

And the fourth one poured out his bowl upon the sun; and to [the sun] it was granted to scorch the men with fire.
And the men were scorched with great heat, but they blasphemed the name of God, who has the authority over these plagues, and they did not repent so as to give glory to him.


Trumpet 5/Woe 1

And the fifth angel blew his trumpet.
And I saw a star that had fallen from heaven to the earth, and the key of the pit of the abyss was given him. And he opened the pit of the abyss, and smoke ascended out of the pit as the smoke of a great furnace, and the sun was darkened, also the air, by the smoke of the pit.
And out of the smoke locusts came forth upon the earth; and authority was given them, the same authority as the scorpions of the earth have.
And they were told to harm no vegetation of the earth nor any green thing nor any tree, but only those men who do not have the seal of God on their foreheads.
And it was granted the [locusts], not to kill them, but that these should be tormented five months, and the torment upon them was as torment by a scorpion when it strikes a man. And in those days the men will seek death but will by no means find it, and they will desire to die but death keeps fleeing from them.
And the likenesses of the locusts resembled horses prepared for battle; and upon their heads [were] what seemed to be crowns like gold, and their faces [were] as men’s faces, but they had hair as women’s hair.
And their teeth were as those of lions; and they had breastplates like iron breastplates. And the sound of their wings [was] as the sound of chariots of many horses running into battle.
Also, they have tails and stings like scorpions; and in their tails is their authority to hurt the men five months.
They have over them a king, the angel of the abyss. In Hebrew his name is A·bad´don, but in Greek he has the name A·pol´lyon.
The one woe is past. Look! Two more woes are coming after these things.

Bowl 5

And the fifth one poured out his bowl upon the throne of the wild beast.
And its kingdom became darkened, and they began to gnaw their tongues for [their] pain, but they blasphemed the God of heaven for their pains and for their ulcers, and they did not repent of their works.


Trumpet 6/Woe 2

And the sixth angel blew his trumpet.
And I heard one voice out of the horns of the golden altar that is before God say to the sixth angel, who had the trumpet: “Untie the four angels that are bound at the great river Eu·phra´tes.” And the four angels were untied, who have been prepared for the hour and day and month and year, to kill a third of the men.
And the number of the armies of cavalry was two myriads of myriads: I heard the number of them.
And this is how I saw the horses in the vision, and those seated on them: they had fire-red and hyacinth-blue and sulphur-yellow breastplates; and the heads of the horses were as heads of lions, and out of their mouths fire and smoke and sulphur issued forth.
By these three plagues a third of the men were killed, from the fire and the smoke and the sulphur which issued forth from their mouths.
For the authority of the horses is in their mouths and in their tails; for their tails are like serpents and have heads, and with these they do harm.
But the rest of the men who were not killed by these plagues did not repent of the works of their hands, so that they should not worship the demons and the idols of gold and silver and copper and stone and wood, which can neither see nor hear nor walk; and they did not repent of their murders nor of their spiritistic practices nor of their fornication nor of their thefts.

Bowl 6

And the sixth one poured out his bowl upon the great river Eu·phra´tes, and its water was dried up, that the way might be prepared for the kings from the rising of the sun.
And I saw three unclean inspired expressions [that looked] like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon and out of the mouth of the wild beast and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
They are, in fact, expressions inspired by demons and perform signs, and they go forth to the kings of the entire inhabited earth, to gather them together to the war of the great day of God the Almighty.
“Look! I am coming as a thief. Happy is the one that stays awake and keeps his outer garments, that he may not walk naked and people look upon his shamefulness.”
And they gathered them together to the place that is called in Hebrew Har–Ma·ged´on.


Trumpet 7

The second woe is past. Look! The third woe is coming quickly.
And the seventh angel blew his trumpet. And loud voices occurred in heaven, saying: “The kingdom of the world did become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will rule as king forever and ever.”
And the twenty-four elders who were seated before God upon their thrones fell upon their faces and worshiped God, saying: “We thank you, Jehovah God, the Almighty, the One who is and who was, because you have taken your great power and begun ruling as king. But the nations became wrathful, and your own wrath came, and the appointed time for the dead to be judged, and to give [their] reward to your slaves the prophets and to the holy ones and to those fearing your name, the small and the great, and to bring to ruin those ruining the earth.”
And the temple [sanctuary] of God that is in heaven was opened, and the ark of his covenant was seen in his temple [sanctuary]. And there occurred lightnings and voices and thunders and an earthquake and a great hail.

Bowl 7

And the seventh one poured out his bowl upon the air.
At this a loud voice issued out of the sanctuary from the throne, saying: “It has come to pass!”
And lightnings and voices and thunders occurred, and a great earthquake occurred such as had not occurred since men came to be on the earth, so extensive an earthquake, so great.
And the great city split into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell; and Babylon the Great was remembered in the sight of God, to give her the cup of the wine of the anger of his wrath.
Also, every island fled, and mountains were not found.
And a great hail with every stone about the weight of a talent descended out of heaven upon the men, and the men blasphemed God due to the plague of hail, because the plague of it was unusually great.

Agape Johnny

Excellent observation Johnny. The trumpets and bowls are identical, while the seals are distinctly different. My opinion is that the first seal is broken at the beginning of the 70th week of Daniel, when the white horse (UN, NWO) takes over (Satan and demons cast out of their principalities in heaven, the great warfare of Daniel 10:1 breaks out, political system collapses....) Obviously it won't be a peaceful time, the next three horsemen are not happy campers. But they all begin their ride before the final 42 months, the end of the Age.

I also think seal #6 comes at the beginning of the final 42 months, halfway into the week, when the remnant of the 144,000 are sealed.


Lou