Paradise Cafe Discussions - A Place For Bible Research And Christian Encouragement

Okay, I'll start off by saying the subject of Nazirites has always been close to my heart for obvious reasons.

It has always been my understanding and, as far as I know, that of the Watchtower that Samuel was a Nazirite. His mother dedicated his life to Jehovah. The Law is explicit that no razor is to touch the head of a Nazirite. There is no exception listed for children who take this vow. Why is it then that in the Bible Story book young Samuel is shown in a freshly shorn state? Should not by the age of five, he already have had long hair?

In my research I have never come across any idea that this vow was not a lifelong one for him. Would his hair not then have eventually reached terminal length - possibly to his hips or lower?

I once talked to an elder about this and he agreed with me. It appears that the Watchtower in the interests of promoting their short hair agenda for males, willfully depicted him contrary to the scriptural account.

Am I missing something? In any case, I would have been all over the Nazirite vow!:thumbsup:

Is that what you have done taken a Nazarite vow?:D  Well no drinking for you!:drinking:

Well I think their depiction of Christ with no beard and short hair was even a worse example.

hello there nana!:hibye:

Well, I you gave me something to think about and look up ... and I either refreshed a poor memory ... more than possible ...:shocked::funnyface:;) or I learned something 'new' ... :clap:

Either way ... thank you for bringing this up ...

My response would be this ...

Since Samuel was a Nazarite from the WOMB ...

Judges 13:5 ...

2 Meanwhile there happened to be a certain man of Zo′rah of the family of the Dan′ites, and his name was Ma·no′ah. And his wife was barren and had borne no child. 3 In time Jehovah’s angel appeared to the woman and said to her: “Look, now, you are barren and have borne no child. And you will certainly become pregnant and give birth to a son. 4 And now watch yourself, please, and do not drink wine or intoxicating liquor, and do not eat anything unclean. 5 For, look! you will be pregnant, and you will certainly give birth to a son, and no razor should come upon his head, because a Naz′i·rite of God is what the child will become on leaving the belly; and he it is who will take the lead in saving Israel out of the hand of the Phi·lis′tines.”

It would make sense that his hair would certainly be on the 'longish' side by the time he was 5 ... I checked out the picture in our Bible Story Book and noticed that young Samuel has THICK hair ... but I wouldn't necessarily say it was long ... as he seems to have very short hair in the front bangs ...

Soooooo I tend to think that, according to how fast his hair grew genetically of course, it is most certainly a valid thought that it could have been a lot longer than depicted here ...

I also, learned that 'new' I mentioned ... that WOMEN could be Nazarites as well ... only I don't recall there being much mention of it ... but then since I wasn't looking ... you never know what I may find now ...:giverose: and I don't think the 'long' hair would be any issue for them ...:love:

Numbers 6:1-8 ...

6 And Jehovah spoke further to Moses, saying: 2 “Speak to the sons of Israel and you must say to them, ‘In case a man or a woman takes a special vow to live as a Naz′i·rite to Jehovah, 3 he should keep away from wine and intoxicating liquor. He should not drink the vinegar of wine or the vinegar of intoxicating liquor, nor drink any liquid made from grapes, nor eat grapes either fresh or dried. 4 All the days of his Naziriteship he should not eat anything at all that is made from the wine vine, from the unripe grapes to the skins.

5 “‘All the days of the vow of his Naziriteship no razor should pass over his head; until the days that he should be separated to Jehovah come to the full, he should prove holy by letting the locks of the hair of his head grow. 6 All the days of his keeping separate to Jehovah he may not come toward any dead soul. 7 Not even for his father or his mother or his brother or his sister may he defile himself when they die, because the sign of his Naziriteship to his God is upon his head.

8 “‘All the days of his Naziriteship he is holy to Jehovah.

Interesting topic ... and since I know you are 'interested in hair' ... it must be one close to your heart ...;):heartbeat:

Luv BR:bouncyhearts:

Oh, I'd gladly give up the alcohol and dead bodies to have long hair with Jehovah's blessing.  That's a no-brainer for me!

Hi BruisedReed,
Thanks for quoting those scriptures. They seem to be very clear to me. Once leaving infancy, hair grows at an average of six inches per year. Even allowing for Samuel to have 'infant hair' for two years, by the time he was five he should have had three years of normal hair growth. Yeah, do the math!:D

Heaven forbid the Watchtower actually portraying a longhaired male of any age. Noooo, can't have that. Just like Jesus was stripped of his beard for so long. :dontknow: Poor John the Baptist always gets shortchanged too. What happened to his Nazirite long hair?

I definitely get the sense that there were both male and female Nazirites. This vow was sacred and the requirements were likewise sacred to Jehovah. What gave the Watchtower license to make a blatant alteration to the inspired account? I think young Samuel probably showed up for service with his hair back in a neat ponytail or braid. As Jehovah intended, this would alert others to his vow and this would continue for his whole life.

Yeah, long hair is something close to my heart.:) I've always had a huge problem with the Watchtower's allowing shorthaired women but not longhaired men. This double standard is just so wrong to me. I don't have a problem with shorthaired women. Just don't use a scripture to discriminate against longhaired men and then ignore the part about short hair on women!

Thanks for your comment.:heartbeat:

Nanamocomuck

Hi brother N (nice hair by the way! :D) The point I quoted above was one of the stuff my husband discussed during his JC meeting. The elders really hated hearing that and one almost had a fit....

Salam, Lou

In one Questions from Readers the Watchtower says that the Scriptures indicate that Jesus would have had "nails", plural in his hands we shouldn't be picky about the artistic representations that show only one.

Nanamochuck are you an active associate of the Watchtower? I would be interested to write to them on this Samuel deal and see what they have to say. The answer might be fun.

Hi Anthony,

It might be fun indeed. The last time I asked a serious question of the Watchtower, it got ignored and forwarded to my local elders who, of course, also had no answers. That's the thing with feeling like you're endowed with wisdom straight from the Almighty. How dare some peon question US?

The fact is they have made an egregious alteration of the scriptural account. I publicly DARE the Watchtower or any of its defenders to justify Samuel's short hair as portrayed in the Society's publications. There is no defense. If they were to have abided by the inspired scriptural account, they would have shown Samuel with long hair and then invited questions from male Witnesses.... In the Watchtower's worldview, it's better to obfuscate the truth rather than invite any potential ideas not laden with Watchtowerisms.

In my view, it is one more nail in the Watchtower's coffin. They claim to be the only way to salvation but are willfully dishonest with biblical accounts. That is just not right and I think Jehovah notices.

Hey Anthony are you mixing me and Nanamocomucks names together and addressing us both or do you even realize that you said nanamochuck.:rofl:

You two are easy to confuse from behind since you both have long hair. :D

Honestly though I think Samuel was just an artistic oversight. Samson in the Bible Story book has long locks. No conspiracy as far as I can see. (I am nearsighted though)

Chuck has long hair???!! This I have to see.:shocked:

Chuck is, as he expressed it the other day, "follically impaired". :D

Anthony,

I think you're being far too generous. Please consult the scriptures BruisedReed cited. Is it not plain that Samuel was a Nazirite? How can his shorthaired depiction be justified? Is it not political or 'Watchtower' correctedness that has caused this misguided portrayal? You have short hair so this may be inconsequential for you. For me, it means A LOT!!

If this is 'God's channel' why the blatant lie? It is so wrong and in so in the vein of......let's not stumble someone, let's distort the truth to our own best interests... to me that is very serious. It is wrong to play loose and fast with the inspired record. What gives them the right to play 'God' when it suits their interests?

Are we talking about Samuel or Samson? I don't remember Samuel ever being a Nazirite.

Samuel was indeed a Nazirite....please consult the scriptures cited by BruisedReed.