Paradise Cafe Discussions - A Place For Bible Research And Christian Encouragement

Pls read with rev seal openings..

1st conquest “by the rider” 5For many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am the Christ,[a]' and will deceive many

2nd civil unrest, lawlessness You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come.

3rd monitary issues?

4th war, famine, plague 7Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places 8All these are the beginning of birth pains.

5then all who are slain receive white robes, they wait until all their brothers are killed. 9"Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me.

6th earthquake, and other natural signs, everyone hides . the day has begun...

The rider thread brought this up.. What was the conquest??
And this is an over lap with matt:24 thats why it's mixed..
When are the Christians killed at the 4th seal? so it seems..
So when did this happen?? or is it yet in the future?

I am not sure why but the more I read it the more it seems to be a short period of time...

The perfect storm is brewing. :read:

TD,

Yes the seven seals line up with Jesus' Olivet discourse recorded in Matthew 24 and Luke 21. What's really awesome is that they also line up with the seven congregations of Revelation 3 & 4. God gave me this revelation a couple months ago. Pretty neat stuff. Get out three Bibles open one up to the seven seals, one open to the seven congregations, and one open to Matthew 24 or Luke 21 and read across in parallel. (Luke 21 is important because it mentions "disease" which Matthew omits. This is the critical link to the fourth seal and fourth congregation.) I wish I could express more but this is a pretty deep mystery and really difficult to put down on paper plus I'm not sure I have it all straight in my head. It is like many layers of semi-transparent paper overlaid on top of one another to bring forth a complete picture.

--

P.S. I'm gonna move this thread to the "end-times" section. Hold on tight.

Thanks Anthony, this is a layer upon layer. I also agree that this important thread needs moving and should be discussed further.

vicky

If you only knew how much I try to avoid talking about prophecy. :crazyeyes:

But this thread has encouaged me to dust off my notes and finish them!

Hey Anthony,

Thanks for the advice.. This is why I just wait things out.

Go over it ... don't understand ... take a break ...
Go over it again ... still don't understand ... take a longer break
... Go over it again ... again ... again ... take a huge break ....

Think I found something ... go over it again ... again, again, again,

Now I forgotten why i was going over it in the first place...

Just a little yoke ... I guess ...
Really thou if I don't get it now I can always get it later ... no problem man ...

Hi anthony

Yes, I'd also like to consider the correspondence between the seven seals, and the seven congregations.

This is a new thought to me, but I guess it makes sense... God likes to repeat himself :dance:

I'm struggling to find a correspondence with the first three, but can see the connection between 4, 5 and 6.

Haven't checked the 7th yet...

Let's talk!

:funnyface:

Interp,

The focus on the congregations is more spiritual than literal.   So when we look at famine, we are talking about spiritual famine.   When we are talking about a great sword, we are talking about God's word.  Here are some brief notes:

Seal 1 - False Christ

Congregation 1 Ephesus - Putting to test those who are false.  False sent-ones (apostles).

Seal 2 - Civil Division.  

It is readily apparent that the 2nd seal of Revelation matches closely with Jesus' Olivet prophesy.   Both have to deal with warefare but there are other subtleties in the vision.    This rider is said to have a great sword and the commision to "take peace away from the earth"   Notice how closely this corresponds with what Jesus speaks of at Matthew 10:34 "Do not think I came to put peace upon the earth; I came to put, not peace but a sword."   This sword is the "sword of the spirit, that is, God's word" (Ephesians 6:17)  "For the word of God is alive and exerts power is sharper than any two-edged sword and peirces even to the dividing of soul and spirit, and of joints and their marrow," (Hebrews 4:12)

Congregation 2 - Smyrna.   They are suffering civil division and being persecuted by their fellow man.

Seal 3 - Famine

Congregation 3 - Pergamum.  Lacking spiritual food.   The food at their table is that which is connected to idols, the table of demons.   Jesus makes a promise that if they overcome he will feed him the hidden manna, the true bread.

Seal 4 - Plague

Congregation 4 - Smyrna.   The congregation is spiritually sick.   Jezebel is be thrown on a sickbed.  Her children are to be given over to plague.

Seal 5 - Martyrs Given White Robes

Congregation 5 - Sardis.   Jesus promises that those who overcome will be given white robes.

Seal 6 - Speaks of judgments that would affect those of the earth.   They wish to be hidden from the face of the lamb.

Congregation 6 - Philadelphia. Jesus promises to keep them from the hour of test.

Seal 7 - The end?

Congregation 7 - Laodicea. "I'm standing at the door knocking."


--

So taken as a whole we have an end times sequences.

1. False apostles and false Christs appear but they are kept by the true apostles who acted as a restraint.
2. Persecution came at the hands of their fellows over God's word which scattered the congregation.  Some of those acting as a restraint get out of the way.
3. The false ones infiltrate the congregation and start teaching fornication and idolatry yet they are still being rebuffed by the congregation.
4. Gradually the false ones start taking over and there is more bad food than good.   The true food is now hidden though not out of reach.
5. Another wave of persecution brings martyrdom.
6. The great tribulation breaks forth.
7. Jesus returns.
   

Maybe this will get your mind going?  I'm not sure of all the details.   Areas 6 and 7 are particularly fuzzy.   Also there may be more connections that can be found.

Wow, nice one Anthony :yahoo:

I hadn't noticed the "hidden manna" in cong. 3. Famine vs Manna!

I will take a deeper look later, when I get more time.

Cheers!

This reminds me of the hidden connection between the gospel of John and the book of Revelation. I think you'll find that fascinating - I'll try and find the link later.

Finally Anthony you are posting some of your research.

Just an extra point the colour of the horse is purros/pyrros. This is where the words pyromaniac and pyrotechnics come from.
It is a fire coloured horse. This represents the increase in unrest and disputes. The outcome may be war, but that is not what the horse specifically represents, rather the inability to find peace.

thanks vicky

The hidden manna also represents the manna in the ark of the covenant, which stayed permanently edible.

Which foreshadowed Jesus Christ, the true bread that comes down from heaven, who is now "hidden" with the ark of covenant in heaven.

I actually have read a bit on not only the seven seals, but also the seven trunpets that follow. Out of all the books in the bible, I find revalations (hope I spelled that right) the most interesting. Maybe I'm just morbidly curious in the idea of an apocaylpse.

I always thought of them as very natural things that could happen, that could be lead by a divine hand. I wish I had my bible here with me, but it's currently still packed away, but for me, it's a series of events that are very believable in not only scientific terms, but also a way to,I don't know if it's the right phrase to use, way to get attention in a world where people have left a God behind. I mean, it talks of mountains from the sky and of the sun's light being blocked..which to me could mean anything from fallout to the dust something of the sort would create, maybe I am reading too far into this, I dunno. Maybe someone could tell me what they think on it. :read:

On another note, I never understood what the "third" or was it second rider meant by the barley thing and the scales...

Hi serifina, I think the scales have always represented Merchants in these instances. so it seems to me that this points to extreeme economic hardships..


Frank
PS bible gateway is an online place to find bibles.

I was reading agian, and it seems that the beast that comes from the abyss comes at the end or near to the end of the tribulation..
This is the very beast that kills the two witnesses. and also the locusts which come from the smoke that blot out the sun,moon,stars are allowed to plague mankind "unsealed" with painfull stings.
for 150 days

Any thoughts?